Fast Tracks

OK,

If I were to use the hopefully soon to be released Frog Helper to create a frog with prestressed curved rail, what are the pitfalls following the curves of a Walthers #8 curved turnout. In other words, if I were to layout the ties in the exact pattern as the walthers turnout, and the inside and outside stock rails match the walthers turnout, am I going to have a problem when I install the frog/points assembly? I don't think I would because I am broadening the curve, not sharpening it, but I don't want to assume anything.

Thanks!

Ken L.

Hi Ken,

Using the tie placements of the Walthers curved turnouts might work ok, there is only one issue I can see. A Walthers curved turnout isn't actually a #8 turnout, nor are any other their other curved turnout sizes. It seems they have "made up" the sizes and don't really match any standards. I believe they just use the # sizes to give a close approximation of how they will compare to the other standard turnouts out there.

That said, you would likely get fairly close, close enough to work, but would be an expensive option.

In addition to the Frog Helper tool, we are also launching something you might be very interested in. See attached picture...

These are our latest addition to the Fast Tracks line, we call them "Twist Ties". These can be used to build straight or curved turnouts, and since they are all based on standard turnout sizes, all our point building tools can be used to create excellent looking and performing trackwork.

Made of all wood ties, and infinately flexible, these have all the necessary spiking holes added, so the proper geometry will be effortlessly acheived by simple pushing the spikes into the pre-drilled holes. In addition to the spiking holes, the outline of the rails have been engraved to allow easy confirmation of accurate rail location.

The documentation for these will be completed today, and I anticipate they will be added to the site over the weekend.

Using our Frog Helper tool will enable you to build 100% perfect points to match exactly the turnout you are building, no compromises, just a geometrically perfect frog point. Where this tool really shines is its ability to work with curved rail, to create properly curved frog points that will extend deep into the frog of the turnout, the main factor in a properly functioning turnout.

This approach will be much more cost effictive then tearing apart a Walther's curved turnout, and will feature all wood ties...

_________________
Cheers!

Tim Warris
Fast Tracks
http://www.fast-tracks.net
service@fast-tracks.net

Here are a few more shots of completed turnouts using the new "Twist Ties"

As can be seen from the pictures, superior looking turnouts can be constructed easily. By using standard turnout geometry, all our point building tools can be used, creating perfect frog and switch points. The key to a smooth running turnout, especially curved ones.

_________________
Cheers!

Tim Warris
Fast Tracks
http://www.fast-tracks.net
service@fast-tracks.net

Is there another way I could secure the rail to the ties without spikes. I do not want to use spikes at all. Thanks!

Ken L.

Using spikes with this method will definitely result on a solid, accurate turnout. You could use an adhesive, but I believe it would not be as effective as the spikes, and would likely take as long as spiking in place.

I know what you mean about spiking a turnout in place, and that is the reason I developed the assembly fixtures, soldering the rail to ties ensures a very solid, unmovable turnout quickly.

This product was developed to fill in the gaps where curved turnouts are needed, albeit, with the compromise of having to use spikes. We have eliminated most of the effort required in spiking a turnout by pre-drilling all the holes necessary, it is possible to build these turnouts without any track gauges! Just placing spikes in the holes will automatically line up all the rails accuractly. We do recommend using an NMRA gauge to get the frog point positioned, and this will be clearly covered in the documentation.

Using an assembly fixture will still result in the best trackwork possible, but they can not address all situations, hence, the new "Twist Ties"

_________________
Cheers!

Tim Warris
Fast Tracks
http://www.fast-tracks.net
service@fast-tracks.net

Thanks Tim,

The reason I do not want to use spikes is because I am using foam board for the subroadbed, and vinylbed for the roadbed. If I use spikes, even if the vinylbed could hold the spikes (which is very questionable at best) it would transmit the "vibration noise" from the track to the foam board. Thanks for the feedback. Maybe I could use a set of twist-ties to make a "prototype" curved turnout to the specs I would like, and make a "jig" for the inside and outside stock rails to use to install the frog/points assembly made from the Frog helper to the stock rails using track guages to insure proper alignment.

Thanks again!

Ken L.

Antoher option would be to lay in the ties first - glued down. The cut out a few and glue in the PC board ties. Use spikes temporarily to hold all in place and solder the assembly to the PC ties. Spot glue the spiked areas (they are no longer holding all the key points) and dress up the turnout.

_________________
-ed mccamey-
COSLAR RR - http://www.coslar.us/
NMRA Standards and Conformance Department
PROTO & FINE Scale Coordinator
I estimate I have about 5 pounds of coupler springs somewhere in the vicinity of my workbench.

OK, let's make sure I understand this correctly.

If I were to use the twist-ties to make this turnout. On it's own "JIG fixture" (so I can make several of them).

To make the "JIG":

I glue the ties to the radius I want (in this case based on a minimum inside radius between 32" - 34") then remove "critical ties and replace them with PC Board Ties (by looking at Fast Tracks Turnout Jigs and determining which ties to replace).

To make each curved turnout:

I will make a #10 frog using prestressed (bent) rail made with the rail bender. Then spike the frog/points assembly, and the inside and outside stock rails to the wood ties, using the NMRA Gauge and Micro Engineering Track Guages to keep the rails in guage. Next, solder the rail to the PC Board ties. Remove the spikes. Take finished assembly, glue ties to fixture and install on layout.

In theory I should be able to do this to make any "custom" turnout, like a #8 curved as well?

Will this method work? What are its downsides? What am I forgetting?

Thanks again for all the feedback!

Ken L.

Ken,

I think you got it OK. Only issue will be the frog number. When curving a turnout, frogs can become really large if you actually curve them. If you plan on keeping it straight through the frog for an inch or two, then you can fit in 'almost' any size frog that you are comfortable with.

Pre-curving the rails to the radius geometry - then filing and making a point that fits (may take some hand fidling) will give you a very fine - smooth and reliable turnout. Be sure and fit the frog point with the NMRA gage fitted on both routes. Set the wing rails just less than the NMRA NO-GO flangeway nub, and set the guard rails with the flangeway nubs check gage. You'll be 'delighted' and proud!

I plan on prebending (prestressing) the rail with the rail bender before making the Frog using the soon-to-be released Frog Helper. Then, using a Micro Engineering track Gauge, and continuously checking with the NMRA Track Guage, I will spike down all the rails of the turnout. Hopefully that will keep everything "in guage". I hope...:-/

Ken L.

These look terrific! Any chance they will be available in N-scale? I'd bet they'd go together great with the photo-etched spikes.

Regards,
Ed

Hi,

It all depends on the demand we receive for them in N scale. Currently we are going to offer these from a #4 thru #12 in HO, HO narrow, S narrow and possibly On30.

While it is possible to spike in N scale, We are just not sure how many modelers would go to this effort, as it would require quite a bit of skill.

_________________
Cheers!

Tim Warris
Fast Tracks
http://www.fast-tracks.net
service@fast-tracks.net

[quote="Tim Warris"]While it is possible to spike in N scale, We are just not sure how many modelers would go to this effort, as it would require quite a bit of skill.[/quote]

I can appreciate that, but from the N-scale work that I've done so far, I've found that it actually doesn't take much more time or effort than spiking an equivalent HO turnout or track. I think that the laser-cut spike holes would make the key difference: these take out a great deal of the variance, and thus obviate the need for high skill levels. The construction procedures are still fundamentally the same in either scale.

Spiking to wood ties in N scale isn't as widespread as other handlaying techniques because it is only very recently that small (photo-etched) spikes have actually become available. But picture conventional, hand-spiked HO scale Code 70 track magically reduced 54% to N scale, and you get a pretty good idea of the results.

About the only other thing to working in the smaller scale is that good working light is all the more important, and perhaps a bit of additional magnification. But these are generally desirable when working in the smaller scales anyway.

Regards,
Ed

I potsed a photo showing a sample of the spiked N-scale trackwork to the Yahoo handlaid track group. Here's a link:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/handlaidt ... NX0023.JPG

(I'm not sure, but I think you have to be a list member to view this -- sorry if that's a cause for any inconvenience.)

For more information of what we are working on for N, Nn3 and Z, have a look here....

http://www.handlaidtrack.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=219

_________________
Cheers!

Tim Warris
Fast Tracks
http://www.fast-tracks.net
service@fast-tracks.net